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INTP "put-offs"/Why don't other types care?
(07-21-2013, 12:43 AM)oldfashionedgirl Wrote: I have noticed in regular life that the INTP has quite the reputation and a lot of times it isn't a good one. I don't understand it but maybe somebody does. I mean I get that people who are not us find us "oddly developed" which is probably true for many types vs types situations. What I DON'T get is that other types do not wish to seek out and know. Even ISTJs, who are supposed to be so "similar" to the INTP. They see something and decide that is the truth. If I see something I spend a day looking that something up all over the place before I accept it as fact, as reality. I don't take a written word as its face value unless it comes from an EXTREMELY credible source (and no I DON'T always count Wikipedia there since anyone can pop in and change that,) whereas other types accept it. I thought it was a "T" thing. But other "T" types don't appear to research either.
I think it's a Ti-Ne thing. My debate teacher in middle school said he's never seen anyone research like me. I'd come in with 20 pages of research and carefully reasoned-out arguments, then foreseen responses to those, and rebuttals to those responses, and rebuttals to the rebuttals of those responses. It's our need to know the truth coupled with our perceiving nature or never feeling like we know enough information or anything is final.

(07-21-2013, 12:43 AM)oldfashionedgirl Wrote: The point, though, is that INTPs are judged in groups. On the forum "Personality Cafe" (which I am not a member of because I have discovered that it's always Open Season on INTPs there) they were discussing something and it went on to INTPs in the middle. Several INTJs popped in and started discussing INTPs, and I chuckled at their half hearted attempts to understand us, and then EVERYBODY jumped in and you would not believe some of the stuff they said. They were quoting off sites about us and stuff and judging on a "basis" as a whole. That is something that as a general rule I do't do at all, but regardless I just don't understand why A. other "T" types and even non-T types don't care to check out their fact before they start spewing information in places where it can't be taken back, and why is that INTPs come off bad all the time for B.?... Like one person (ISFJ I think it said, not pointing fingers at types here, like I said I don't judge in groups) said something about how they HATE INTPs because they are so shallow, self centered, unfeeling, cold, uncaring, selfish, and altogether rude.
This is a general trend in humankind. I would wager that a lot of the Thinkers on personality cafe aren't even Thinkers. It's kind of like this; you decide you are an ISFJ. You 'learn' that ISFJs and INTPs are very different and are informed that INTPs are cold and selfish. You meet someone you don't like who is cold and selfish. You decide they are INTP. And every time you meet someone who even remotely fits the stereotypical INTP description, you decide they are INTP, until you have so many "INTP"s that you hate that you decide that you hate all INTPs. That's how it works. I, for one, don't think I fit the INTP stereotype at all. I am not cold, though I am logical. I am animated. I am not serious all of the time. I care for others very deeply and have very strong emotions. But there is no doubt that I am INTP. So these people really don't know what they are talking about.

(07-21-2013, 12:43 AM)oldfashionedgirl Wrote: I understand how we come across as unfeeling and cold and the whole 9 yards there, but all the other stuff? I'm sure there are some like this but this person said they had known like 5 INTPs and they were all like that, always talking about themselves and being hard-heads in arguments when the other person had facts to show that said INTP is wrong.

This would be an example of what I stated above.

(07-21-2013, 12:43 AM)oldfashionedgirl Wrote: I am not venting here- I just want to know WHY. Or better yet HOW. HOW can an INTP actually IGNORE facts in an argument? To me if I'm in an argument and the other person shows me some big facts I back away and look at them because I put a lot of sway in facts and logic, and I would rather look at where I could be wrong rather than ignore the chance to double check and run off some stupid emotion telling me not to quit even though it looks like I'm obviously wrong. I think these people are just judging INTPs from people who are NOT INTPs and these people are giving us a bad reputation!
So I guess I want to know..... Why do other T types and the other types not care about making sure they are correct and not accidentally spewing lies when they make a point,
Why do INTPs apparently come across as bullies to non-INTPs,
How could a REAL INTP just ignore facts like that?
Because even Thinkers are swayed by feelings. For example, I have pride sometimes, of the bad kind. I don't like being wrong. Sometimes I will argue my point with my INTP friend even though I figured out that he was right at the beginning of the conversation. I don't like it, but I do it. Then I finally admit that I was wrong at the very end where arguing further would just be stupid. The interesting thing is, Te is the type of thinking that is more facts-oriented, but I imagine that since Te-dominants are Judgers they like closure and so sometimes they might make a judgement prematurely. And the people with Te that aren't Judgers are Feelers. I don't know if that matters, but that might make a difference.

(07-21-2013, 12:43 AM)oldfashionedgirl Wrote: Okay, now I have likely manged to confuse everyone but I hope that makes some sense! Big Grin
(BTW I would like to say that while I saw all that to be connected in my head when I tried to explain it here the whole connection went ka-ploop and it looks like total random stuff all together but hey....)

I think you made sense Smile The whole INTP reputation is bogus. We're all pretty different, but we have similar thought processes. The thing is, in PersonalityCafe, everything is based off of stereotypes, and people always need a specific group to bag on--so that group is the INTPs. Such is life. I highly doubt that many of those people have got their type right, or are just acting through this stereotype that they feel they should fulfill.
"It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes." --Douglas Adams
(07-25-2013, 03:54 PM)Pickwick12 Wrote: I've noticed the prejudice as well. Unfortunately, most places I've seen that focus on types, other than this one, degenerate into nastiness in some way. I actually think type-specific gathering places are a much better idea across the board. That way, we can enjoy the similarities and unpack the variations in a single type, like we do here, rather than trying to etch out space for ourselves in the melee.

I really like the way you've described what makes the Refuge work. I'd been wondering why here works and other places don't seem to (not just in terms of Jung/MBTI but other interests). Thanks Smile
(11-15-2013, 09:09 AM)Nyssa1968 Wrote: [quote='Pickwick12' pid='3089' dateline='1374782082']
I really like the way you've described what makes the Refuge work. I'd been wondering why here works and other places don't seem to (not just in terms of Jung/MBTI but other interests). Thanks Smile

Think most of us end up here because of the articles, which are dealing with the component of our personality (feelings) that is ignored/denied by people engaged in type wish-fulfillment. Those people naturally won't be looking for information about something they've convinced themselves doesn't exist.
In ordinary life, I have noticed that the INTP has a good reputation, and many times it is not good. I do not understand, but perhaps someone. I understand that people who are not with us; we are "surprising development", which is probably true of many types and styles. Go for best essay writing service ukreviews. What I do not get - this is something that other types do not want to look for and be aware. Even ISTJ, which should be as "similar" to the INTP.
I really wish I could tell you. I've been thinking about this too and it just bothers me sooo much. I think it's because we live in a society were people want excuses for everything, and I think INTPs tend to be the people who believe in being held accountable for what you did because that keeps the fact straight. People don't want to know the truth, they want you to hold their hand and tell them that it's ok they screwed up. They're still pretty little snowflakes. Something about the refusal of growing up and learning and people losing the meaning of tolerance and...I think it's a lot of things.
Maybe it's simply the online element. People act very vain and egotistical online and forget that people are people and they get in more arguments and...I have no clue where to go with this. I may be compromised, I can't think of how to word anything properly, but I've been thinking about this a lot and just. It's a lot of things. I wish I had it, but I don't. Hopefully someone can help me out here. XD I hope you understand what I'm trying to say.

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